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Author Topic: BNP Local Election Success  (Read 2447 times)
lems
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« on: May 03, 2002, 09:23:34 am »

So the British National Party had a couple of their candidates elected in Burnley in the local elections yesterday and many are shocked by this.  Let me first pin my colours to the mast - I was born of mixed race parents and I detest racism in any form but I speak as a person who lives in an area of London that has been flooded with refugees in recent years - local people are angry and tensions run high.

My question - Is the BNP election success sad but understandable and possibly a sign of things to come?

Over to you.

Lemmie.

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bethalize
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« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2002, 11:56:41 am »

A sign of things to come? Yes, probably, unfortunately. However, it is to be hoped that if this movement were to gather strength, people would exercise their right to vote and block any further attempts. I think that voter apathy provides a window of opportunity for such parties. It shows that when you have a right, you also have a duty. I would also hope that by now we have learned not to look away when bad things happen, at least, not on our own doorsteps.

Racism seems to come out of ignorance and fear. I wonder at racists who think that a similarity of skin colour, language and culture make them the same as me. I would rather bring my Muslim friend with whom I share interests and values into my home than white people for whom I have nothing but contempt and pity. The lack of perspective that these people show is frightening. It worries me than in a society that has had total education for more than thirty years, we are still failing to educate people and to teach that differences are not only normal but necessary.


Bethalize
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andream
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« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2002, 12:41:23 pm »

And for me, being new to the entire UK electoral process, I had to do some research, but what seems to come out of it, is that this is the equivelant of the US electing someone highly placed in the KKK to public office. Are these people(the BNP) the thugs that basic research indicates?! Surely not.  I would like more information, and do NOT wish to upset anyone, but being new to the politics of my new home would welcome your viewpoints on ALL the parties in question.  I'm still trying to figure out if Tory roughly compares with a US Republican party and if Labor, Compares with Democrat, but if that's so where does that leave the liberal democrats, Anyone with any expertise in both US and UK politics is welcome to do a compare and contrast for me!

Andrea

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Jackie G
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« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2002, 02:44:51 pm »

I won't profess to know much about politics, but I can confirm your thinking is correct vis a vis Tories/Republicans

The BNP is rising again - they had a brief period in the 70s? maybe 80s?  A journalist I know said on radio this morning that he had the 'chilling experience' of interviewing the BNP leader last year - interesting phraseology to use.  He said the man was very cold

It will be interesting to see what happens in France this weekend though - that is as worrying!

As for Scottish politics just now, my friend who works at the parliament has just rung for the 2nd time in 2 days with yet another resignation - yesterday an SNP MSP resigned from the party and today a prominent Labour MSP resigned from the Cabinet in Scotland!  Interesting times . . .

Jackie
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bethalize
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« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2002, 03:00:28 pm »

Thugs? No, far more dangerous. If they were just thugs, we could lock them up. Unlike the National Front, the BNP disguise their prejudice in supposedly logical arguments. If you look at their "What we stand for" page on their website, they have policies that can seem attractive. "Crack down on crime" and "No to pollution" are two. They seem to practice a form of isolationism - no to Europe, no to foreign aid, no to asylum seekers. They say they "don't 'hate '" Asian or black people, they just want to "preserve the ethnic and cultural identity of the British people", completely missing the point that Britain has always been a place for immigrants and has no pure aboriginal tribe.
I find their claims ridiculous, but the danger is that the less informed you are, the more likely you are to be attracted to them. They want to ship out anyone who is not "racially pure" - imagine if that happened in America! The best analogy I can think of is that they want society to be like it was between the two world wars.  They miss out on the basic premise of nature that you have to change to evolve. A good example of their half-truths is "We have lived in these islands near on 40,000 years! " Hello? Romans, Celts, Angles, Danes, Saxons, Normans and other Europeans have all become absorbed, not to mention the Scottish, Welsh and Irish (who were Celts and Picts and all sorts at one time).

The three main British parties have changed a lot in the last twenty years. To understand how the system came about you really need to go back before the industrial revolution.

In a very simplified nutshell, Labour was for the Workers, the Tories were for the Owners and the Liberals were a bit of a joke. They haven't been in power for the last eighty (?) years. During the 70s the Labour Governement were in power and there were lots of industrial disputes - strikes - and high taxes. In 1979 Margaret Thatcher became Prime Minister and the world as we know it began (remember I was born in '76!). The Unions were crushed, you could now earn lots more money under the tax scheme (to encourage people) and there was emphasis on being responsible for yourself. Power was devloved from Westminster to local councils. They privatised everything they could get their hands on - chemicals, rail, steel, gas, water, electricity, telephones. This was all well and good for a time, until the NHS began to crumble, there was a recession and people began to realise that not paying taxes meant no society and no help when you needed it and privatised companies found that they couldn't continue to act as a state monopoly when competing for business. They appeared decadent and uncaring. Now they just seem out of touch. Student Tory groups always act like it is still 1911 and they are industrialists.

Just before the General Election of 1997 the Labour Party changed into "New Labour", casting out their socialist background. Conservatism with a small c for conscience. Following election they have - now, what have they done? They have certainly put more duty on cigarettes, but on the other hand all that money is going to the NHS. They have upped National Insurance contributions but not raised taxes. This means us workers have to pay more but people with lots of money in savings don't. However, a pub straw poll will show that it doesn't really make an enormous difference to individuals. £2 a week or something, depending on what you earn, obviously. They have introduced tuition fees to universities for undergraduates (more of a levy, really) and they messed that up for a start. Peace to Northern Ireland. Scottish Parliament and Northern Irish and Welsh Assemblies. There are attempts at making things better for working parents and the elderly, which I suppose is a good thing. Do I sound like a fan? Sorry. I assure you I am not.

The Lib Dems have only been the Lib Dems since 1988. They were the Whigs, the Liberals, The SDP Liberal Alliance, You can take them more seriously now than you could fifteen years ago. They are big in local government and are the largest third party in Parliament in about a century. See their website.

The Republicans would be more like the Conservatives, New Labour more like the Democrats. I presume that much is obvious, but there isn't really much to chose between the Rs and the Ds or the Cs and the Ls, although your Republican party seems scarily extreme in places.

There is so much more to say, but I have to go and do some work!


http://www.libdems.org.uk
http://www.labour.org.uk/
http://www.conservatives.com/

Bethalize
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akara
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« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2002, 09:13:31 am »

I read a fairly distubing article in a London newspaper recently about an ordinary British middle-class young couple who were both BNP candidates.  It seems the BNP is shifting their tactics - trying to appeal to the ordinary 'respectable' family person who is concerned about rising crime and unemployment, and get away from their 'thug' image.  Perhaps their tactic is working - the BNP seems to get more and more votes with every election.

THe price of democracy is that everyone is entitled to a voice, no matter how abhorrant you find their opinions.  But it becomes more and more important to use your vote - when apathy sets in, that's when the extreme political parties gain votes (look at what happened in France).  So use your vote - even if you don't want to vote for anyone in particularly, there's probably someone you definitely don't want to win.

Akara



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